Silver Bullet with organics?

[sybarite]

Hello GR420,

I've been getting an eggy smell in my tank that's caused by bad bacteria. My system is RTW so nothing is recirculating. I'm using GHO's The End with beneficial anaerobic microbes. I did an experiment with a solution of those in a separate bucket and it was left for more than a week in the same room in same conditions with no eggy smell. Many other people have been using The End and BAM with no such issues proving those are not the problem, therefore it must be something in my pipes, pumps or tank, or the pH adjustment (BioBizz Bio-Down or Plagrom Lemon Kick which are probably both citric acid) causing it. I have thoroughly cleaned my tank and pumps with a strong solution of hot water and Silver Bullet twice, then with isopropyl and hot water, pumping it through the system a few times and leaving the rest to soak for 24 hours, then flushing again with clean, filtered water.

The first time I took the pumps out and apart there was quite a bit of biofilm gunk in them from using Ionic previously, especially in the sponge filter so I binned that and won't be replacing it. After that the smell took longer to come back, so it seems to have worked a bit. My theory now is that the pipes might still have biofilm gunk in them and it's flowing back into the tank when the pump goes off - I punched an anti-siphon hole near the top of the feed pipe inside the tank to prevent floods, so some solution does flow back to the tank.

My question is, is it safe to use Silver Bullet in a tank along with organic nutrients?

I have asked GHO and said it probably won't hurt but admittedly doesn't have much experience with hydro/coco. It will obviously kill any beneficial microbes so no point using BAM as well but the microbes are less or not at all important in hydro/coco.

I'm going to clean my pumps and tank again, and replace all the pipes but maybe using Silver Bullet in the tank with my nutrients will save me some work in future.

Any advice appreciated!

[Marcus]

Silver bullet is expensive, I would just run a cheap h2o2 weekly to keep the tank from sliming up.

So when you need to fill the tank, fill it with clean water and h2o2... leave it for a bit and then add the feed to the tank.

That's how I've always kept my tanks from gunking up.

From my limited knowledge of h2o2... it's a free radical hippy killing machine, and it dissipates rather quickly after beating up the slimy junk and leaves the water more oxygenated with nothing nasty to affect the plants.

I've always got a bottle knocking around, I use the Growth Technology stuff at about £7 a litre.

[2-Scoops]

Nah you cant use it if your growing organically the h202 in silver bullet will wipe out the life in your soil.

Not organic grower but its always bugged me why peeps use anaerobic bacteria, which lives and thrives in a little to zero oxygenated environment, so to me its far from ideal for your roots possibly or maybe inviting problems, feck knows... I would have thought using aerobic bacteria in your feed mix is the better option which thrives in an oxygenated environment so much better for roots, well so i would think with my little bit to zero knowledge of organics. Maybe its because they like a high carbon dioxide type environment to thrive and i think plant takes this in through roots too ? But to me running with a more oxygenated root environment has to be the better way to go surly. Anyone explain it to me cus im prolly miles off here spouting my usual doo-dah

If you left the anaerobic stuff out of your mix @sybarite and added a little sugar to it instead and then bubbled it away with a airstone it would soon come to life full of oxygen loving microbes, doing that would create an aerobic environment full of microbes in your mix to give to plant pot and provide roots with oxygen without the need for anaerobic, surly that's better and cheaper ? Or so i would think.

[Marcus]

Nah you cant use it if your growing organically the h202 in silver bullet will wipe out the life in your soil.

Not organic grower but its always bugged me why peeps use anaerobic bacteria, which lives and thrives in a little to zero oxygenated environment, so to me its far from ideal for your roots possibly or maybe inviting problems, feck knows... I would have thought using aerobic bacteria in your feed mix is the better option which thrives in an oxygenated environment so much better for roots, well so i would think with my little bit to zero knowledge of organics. Maybe its because they like a high carbon dioxide type environment to thrive and i think plant takes this in through roots too ? But to me running with a more oxygenated root environment has to be the better way to go surly. Anyone explain it to me cus im prolly miles off here spouting my usual doo-dah

I think he's in coco Jimbo.

(Of which I see no point in having "bennies" in.)

But yes, I;m also with you on the anaerobic stuff and roots.

[2-Scoops]

I think he's in coco Jimbo.

(Of which I see no point in having "bennies" in.)

But yes, I;m also with you on the anaerobic stuff and roots.

As said i know little about it, but it just doesn't sound good to me running a root system with very little oxygen in your just inviting problems, especially when you can run a root system that is full of oxygen and loads of microbes for free or lets say a few spoons full of Tate & Lyle . It just seems like its inviting problems. I might be wrong mate, but its shit in my head says it just dont sound right thing to do. .

[GMO]

@2-Scoops @Marcus they arent truly anaerobic just a name choice. theyre really facultative microbes and of know species which are beneficial. Some even produce H2O2 as part of their life cycle

[GHO]

Nah you cant use it if your growing organically the h202 in silver bullet will wipe out the life in your soil.

Not organic grower but its always bugged me why peeps use anaerobic bacteria, which lives and thrives in a little to zero oxygenated environment, so to me its far from ideal for your roots possibly or maybe inviting problems, feck knows... I would have thought using aerobic bacteria in your feed mix is the better option which thrives in an oxygenated environment so much better for roots, well so i would think with my little bit to zero knowledge of organics. Maybe its because they like a high carbon dioxide type environment to thrive and i think plant takes this in through roots too ? But to me running with a more oxygenated root environment has to be the better way to go surly. Anyone explain it to me cus im prolly miles off here spouting my usual doo-dah

Anaerobic is a misnomer 2scoops, they're facultative so function in aerobic and anaerobic environments. Also these species don't turn your soil aerobic it's completely different to the stuff that breeds in a waterlogged soil which would be a problem.

The end is a hybrid with organics, the only thing in it that'll be affected by the silver bullet is the microbes within the end. But as @sybarite is growing in Coco rather than soil the microbial element isn't as relevent. Probably the best thing to do would be to mix a bit of each product in water and leave it for a week to double check for any potential reaction.

As mentioned the other day I don't know much about the various ways people run a reservoir, but I understand my product well enough. Silver bullet will harm the microbe element, but I don't see that outweighing dealing with whatever has taken hold in the reservoir previously. If you're not growing in soil, looking at it with the soil mentality of protecting beneficial microbes will keep you going round in circles.
Hygiene should be your top priority here buddy.

[GHO]

@2-Scoops @Marcus they arent truly anaerobic just a name choice. theyre really facultative microbes and of know species which are beneficial. Some even produce H2O2 as part of their life cycle

Beat me to it @GMO

[sybarite]

Thanks everyone, all input is appreciated!

[sybarite]

Silver bullet is expensive, I would just run a cheap h2o2 weekly to keep the tank from sliming up.

So when you need to fill the tank, fill it with clean water and h2o2... leave it for a bit and then add the feed to the tank.

That's how I've always kept my tanks from gunking up.

From my limited knowledge of h2o2... it's a free radical hippy killing machine, and it dissipates rather quickly after beating up the slimy junk and leaves the water more oxygenated with nothing nasty to affect the plants.

I've always got a bottle knocking around, I use the Growth Technology stuff at about £7 a litre.

Good tip on the cheaper h2o2, thanks Marcus. I assumed the silver component would be more aggressive on the nasties and keep it stable in the tank longer, so less is needed over time.

It would be a problem for me starting with a clean tank of only water each time. I want less work not more, hoping to top up what's already in there but at the moment I am having to empty the tank and clean it every couple of days, which is a chore due to the cramped nature of the location, having to slide the tent out of the way to get enough purchase on the tank, tripping over wires, making puddles, cursing. I need to move!